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Sunday, September 26, 2010

BASE FILE DO NOT DELETE

Logo

Text about what we did here

SUGGESTED USES:















































OVERALL BUILD

  • Number of holds:
  • Type (Bolt / Screw Ons):
  • Price per hold (set price divided by number of holds):
  • Color:
  • Bolt placement:
  • Sanding:
  • Hollow backed:
  • Soft back (Rubber backed):
  • Texture:
  • Set size:
  • Versatility:
  • Pre-drilled screw holes:
  • Shaper:
  • Weight:
WHAT ARE THEY MADE FROM:

PACKING / SHIPPING:

RATING:
Noodles:

Chris:

PROS:
  • YADDA
CONS:
  • YADDA

Review > HRT > Atlantis

HRT Climbing
HRT are a European company and their holds are something we've wanted to play on for a while... why? Because they have some holds that just have some far out names like "Cow Poop", "Bootie Call" and some other stuff that's is just a little strange... the other reason is this they have the same composite holds that Holdz have... remember those guys? (If you missed that review you can find it: here), the make up of the HRT Atlantis that we're looking at this week is the same (they are made at the same place in Europe)... so lets see what's up:


The hold on the left is a Holdz Undercutz, it has the same hollow backed design... and we really put that guy to the test...we torqued it up to well over what anyone setting can do with a wrench or a torque wrench... so much so we were worried what would happen if it did actually break (something like a grenade going off) and then to top it off Noodles threw one of them out of a second floor window to a concrete floor and it just bounced.

Now not to be outdone we did something very similar with the HRT Atlantis, they went straight off of the balcony and it just got a little bit scuffed up from hitting the floor. Then we pulled the same torque test with it and again we backed off before we broke the hold; but we were hanging on a scaffold bar to get the wrench to turn anymore. We were actually worried that we'd break the bit or the bolt before the hold... so in the interest of self preservation we stopped. So these holds are strong as hell and they're very light, so light in fact that if you've seen any adverts for HRT they show the holds actually floating in water. Do they float? Well yes actually they do.. crazy

Right off of the bat... before all the North Americans decide to stop reading because these holds are from Europe let us just drop a little nugget of information for you... these holds are available here from Walltopia... sneaky buggers. They keep a fairly limited stock on hand but they do get a couple of shipments a year, of both the CompozIT holds and the resin holds... so you can keep reading on!

So the holds are strong and light, take pretty much any bolt you care to use... but what are they actually like to climb on?

First off these holds when new feel like they're very soft, almost kitten soft, it's a hard thing to describe but that's the way they feel. All of the holds have lots of grooves in them, we were kind of worried that with the texture being so kind that the grooves would be the only thing you're going to end up hanging off of... so we were thinking "these are just going to end up being slopers"... WRONG... these holds look like slopers but aren't really slopers, they end up being more pinches than anything else.. but then it really comes down to where you set them and on what angle

Setting problems with only 6 holds is always going to be a tricky affair, we wanted to have something slightly longer to start with so we could see how the holds bedded in, so we grabbed the Boss and "Spanky" (Tekniks Arnold hold) and went to work. Noodles started a route that went straight off of the Boss to a Motavation volume with the first hold on it to a long move to the side of the 45/60 wall... then a long throw to Spanky and then into a little traverse with the thinner holds of the set; then we added feet and we were ready to roll. Overall for Chris and Noodles the route was just too easy, the holds had more grip and more areas where they could be used that we'd at first suspected. Anyone that didn't have the power (or the reach) to bridge the gap and drop their foot down had a harder time getting the moves down... and then it came down to balance and who had small hands. Dora ended up just being hooked on the route, she knew that she could do it but has having a hard time just sticking the moves.

SUGGESTED USES:







Another week and another new symbol!!
The thinner holds (top left two holds of the top image) have a fairly limited use as they're so thin and there isn't all the much to grab, people with smaller hands will have a far easier time with these than your normal monkey clawed brethren :) But they would make for some very interesting climbing on a slabby wall or as a palm around a corner or an arete.

When you look at the other four holds in the set then you're basically looking at some large friendly slopers that climb quite well on a 45 degree wall, but you'll end up pinching more than slapping and then trying to pull yourself up and move from there, on any wall less than 45 you can easily use these in their sloper mode... the added benefit of this is that when you're traversing with the holds you can switch you hands and get a pinch in.

Although we had these guys up on the 70 degree wall we had lessened the impact by putting them onto a volume, we tried the larger guys on a horizontal roof and the two obvious pinches (top right and bottom left of the top image) have enough area to them that allows you to get your hands matched and then be able to move your feet (the ridged lines help here more than you'd think) up to where you want them and then be able to move... it's a tricky / powerful way to go about things but it's more than do-able. The other holds are actually better when on the roof than the pinches as you can match your hands in the scoops and then you can tension your body to move, but you have to be quite high on the holds for this to be feasible.



OVERALL BUILD
  • Number of holds: 6
  • Type (Bolt / Screw Ons): Bolt
  • Price per hold: 94.4 Euros = $148: approx $24.60 per hold (USD)
  • Color: Orange
  • Bolt placement: Centre
  • Sanding: Good
  • Hollow backed: Yes
  • Soft back (Rubber backed): No
  • Texture: Very soft
  • Set size: Large
  • Versatility: Wide pinches or slopers
  • Pre-drilled screw holes: Yes
  • Shaper: TBC
  • Weight: 3.33kg / 7.34lbs

The set is a little weird when you look at them, there are four large slopers / pinches and two holds that at best are pretty thin and not really matchable (unless your hands are tiny) and these two holds sure as hell aren't slopers (like the HRT site suggests)... maybe if these holds are on a slab then sure they will then come into their own, but most home walls don't have slabs as they're not good for training purposes. There are two sets of Atlantis holds, a 5 hold set and a 6 hold set, the 6 hold set has the two tiny guys... it's a shame the 5 hold set isn't a complimentary set of holds for slabs / shallow walls and the 6 hold set for slightly steeper walls; it's just a minor complaint

CompozIT is something we've played with before, the holds float are strong and are lighter than anything else if you compare a PU hold against them. They take a bunch of different bolt types and they all have set screw placements, although to be honest we didn't need to use them as the holds seem to suck into the wall quite well, there was only one instance when one of the holds spun on Noodles but that was because we hadn't tightened it up enough :( All of the holds are hollow backed and when you look at the image to the left that's pretty impressive given that's one of the thin guys and there is a set of AA batteries next to it.

All of the holds have a little number stamped into them that allows you to know which hold you're holding onto, it's very subtle but they are there. The HRT logo is stamped into all of the holds. As these holds come from the same place as Holdz they have a "birth date stamped within the back" they also have a QA stamp in the back as well so if anything does go wrong the batch can be tracked some problems can be sorted out. Mind you if you're looking for some of the number it has to be said that they can be easily missed... thankfully they're so small and out of the way that you never need worry about the logo or the hold number getting in the way of your climbing enjoyment.

The texture is something called Positive Relief and it feels very very soft to the touch and has much more grip than you'd think. All of our holds are orange, the color is nice and even throughout the entire set.

WHAT ARE THEY MADE FROM:
CompozIT

PACKING / SHIPPING:
Not bad

RATING:
Noodles:
This one has been a long time coming :) HRT and CHR have played email tag for ages, we mail them get no reply, they mail us and we don't see it... but it came together in the end.

I've been looking at HRT holds for a long time, knowing that they come from the same place as Holdz and that they use the same CompozIT technology that we've seen before but with some more realistic shapes meant we really wanted to play with them. HRT do rock resin holds as well... but we all know that resin is heavy and when you look at a urethane hold against this technology then you notice the weight difference is massive (if you had the same hold in say urethane and CompozIT then you'd probably look at maybe 75% lighter for compozIT) that's pretty significant when you think about setting long routes / shipping and a whole bunch of other factors.

When you feel these holds you sit back and think... they don't feel like normal holds, they have a soft very fine texture to them. I thought that they were going to climb like a bag of crap, between the "not so grippy texture" to the ridges in the holds I was thinking that they were just going to suck! Boy was I wrong, totally wrong, once you get onto the holds the first time you just stick to them... they could be some of the grippiest holds we've seen in a long time, they also don't trash your skin to hell either... what IS this CompozIT? I like it, I like it a lot. Add the fact that they are available to us here without getting hit with some mental shipping charges it sweetens the deal... I'd have preferred the holds to have not of had the smaller thinner two holds in the set but that's just personal preference!

Oh yeah, I may have thrown one of them off of the balcony... how bad was the damage? It was just scuffed

Chris:
I'm not on the internet as much as Noodles, so my first introduction to HRT was at our local gym, Allez Up. They got a couple of HRT holds in fluo green and I was like "wow! cool holds!", but when I told Noodles, he was already well aware of the company and their exposure in Canada.

I had the same reaction when we received our set of Atlantis holds. They don't have these holds at the gym but I love the balance between sloper, pinch and crimps. I've been talking a lot with the setters at Allez Up and I've found that they mostly like the simple shapes but I think that a set with the intricate textured lines has a place in a commercial setting. The small cracks on the holds replicate more of the feeling of climbing outside. Just by micro adjusting where your fingers are on the hold will give you more or less grip. There are so many little cracks on these holds that it gives the climbers more of options on their hand placement.

What I found weird about this set is the difference in difficulty between the slopers and the thinner more crimpy holds. I could see pretty much anybody working out sequences on the slopers and the pinching option incorporated into the shapes make them good for overhanging terrain as well. But the crimpers don't give you much to grab are really hard holds to stick. These holds are good for those strong climbers but are limited to a more novice climber. As a whole though, the set all together makes for some fun setting.

PROS:

  • Well designed hollow back.. super light and super strong holds
  • Set covers a wide range of grips
  • Solid, bright colors
CONS:
  • Available from BC, Canada; but Walltopia doesn't carry a huge stock of holds... you will have to see what they have in stock or order for their next shipment from Europe to be able to really take advantage of some savings
  • Strange mix of holds within the set, the two thin guys don't really fit in too well

Friday, September 17, 2010

Tuesday, September 14, 2010

Interview > Greener Grass Publishing > Stone Fort Bouldeing Guide

US FLAG
There is something about climbing guides, well written and laid out climbing guides that allows the user to find an area and it's climbs quickly and easily. We've had some proper shite guides, Noodles can relate stories about Fontainbleau where finding a climb involved two guide books, a rabbits foot and pot luck; we can show you the printed out Val David guides that involve the use of a divining rod, three satellites and napalm strengh bug repellant to find a climb.

Stone Fort used to be like this, but now the bullet white sandstone has a saviour who goes by the name of Andy Wellman & Greener Grass PublishingYou're going to wonder where you know the name Stone Fort, it's probably because if you follow the Triple Crown one of their stops is at this area right down by one of our favortie climbing areas HP40

When you first open the book the format is clean and simple and once you get past the adverts (people have to make money I guess) ; the page on bouldering ethics (you SHOULD know these already) you start to get into the meat of the area with all of the details you need to know; land access and right etc the guide starts.



The layout is clean and simple with the areas (sample shown above) having their own write up, an overview map of that area and then the problems listed one by one with nice big color photos and lines to show you where the route actually starts and get this where the climb ends... so there can't be any spraying about being off line or not completing a climb :)

If that wasn't enough add inteviews with people like Luiz Rodriguez & Marvin Webb (the co-owner of Rock/Creek Outfitters (super fun read btw)) and then a whole host of really nice photos of people like Lisa Rands, Jason Kehl, Nic Oklobjia from some really quite respected climbing photographers it almost seems like a shame to take the book outside and trash it in the dirt :P

We liked the book so much we decided to have a sit down and chat with Andy, the guides author:

Name and job:
Andy Wellman – owner of Greener Grass Publishing.

So you aren't just the guide book author you're the owner of the company that publishes the guides?
Yes, I am the owner of the company that publishes the guidebook, and in the case of Stone Fort Bouldering, I am the author as well. This is the first guidebook that I have ever written, though. In most cases I work as a publisher to help authors produce their books.

How long has Greener Grass Publishing been publishing guidebooks?
I began Greener Grass Publishing in March of 2009, so it has been around for about a year and half at this point. Before that I worked as an editor/designer/ and sales and shipping guy for Wolverine Publishing, another guidebook publisher based in Colorado. Stone Fort Bouldering is the second book published by Greener Grass Publishing, the first one was Horse Pens 40 Bouldering, written by Adam Henry.

You sent us the new Stone Fort guide, it's a thing to behold, how long did it take to put together?
Thanks, I’m glad you like the book. The book came together in two phases, both of which had tight deadlines due to the financial considerations involved in starting and maintaining a business. The first stage was researching the information, which took me about four months. At the time that I started collecting info I had already been living close to the Stone Fort and climbing there about 2 days a week for the previous 8 months, so I had a good idea of what I didn’t know about the place, and would need to find out. During this phase I drew the maps, wrote the descriptions, took all the boulder photos, lined up the support from the key players, met with climbers out there to get tours of things I didn’t know, and arranged all the essays and interviews in the guide, as well as the action photos and advertisements.
The second phase was the design and layout phase. I took all the raw info that I had collected and in one feverish 6 week span created the whole book that you see. I worked for 8-14 hours a day, 6-7 days a week for 6 weeks to get it all done. It was brutal, it’s much more fun to work without a deadline.

There are lots of interesting interviews with some characters, who was your favorite to talk to?
I’m not sure that I could pick a favorite. Talking to everyone was interesting because they each have a different story, and everyone I would talk with would tell me things I didn’t know. Meeting Jeff Drumm and Luis Rodriguez out at the Stone Fort one steamy morning was really fun cause they showed me so many problems that had been lost to time. There were things that were buried in moss that I never could have dreamed had been climbed that they had stories about doing 10 years before.

There were actually lots of people that I never managed to get in touch with, which I would have liked to have talked to. Everyone I talked to would give me a list of a bunch more names, and soon I had way way more names than I could track down, find the time to talk with, or fit in the book. If there is another edition down the road, hopefully I can fit more history into the book.

What grade do you climb?
This past winter while working on the guide I was bouldering V8’s on a good day.

So how many of the routes from Stone Fort have you actually climbed?
I’m not exactly sure, but I’m guessing around 400. I guess I should use the tick list from the book to find out!

Any stand out lines that spring to mind?
Way too many. Grimace, Heroin, Celestial Mechanics, Instinct, Tennessee Thong, those are probably my favorites. Moderate classics like the Wave or Tristar I climb pretty much every time I go there.

Do you have any projects there still?
Yeah, lots. There are way too many to name.

How are the descriptions of the climbs written? Is it just you or did the areas developers help?
The descriptions were written by me. The previous guide to the area was in the form of a little pamphlet put out by the Triple Crown Bouldering Series. I wanted the book to be unique, so I set out to rewrite descriptions for everything without plagiarizing. I set out to climb or attempt every single problem that had ever been done there, and after doing it or attempting it for a while, I would speak the description into a digital voice recorder, then type it up at home later. At first I set out to record 40 new problems every day, a goal which I didn’t come close to meeting for a couple weeks. By the time I was done I was recording 60-70 problems a day. Plenty of days I would encounter friends out there and would have to make excuses to not join them on a rad project, instead I would keep bouldering dirty obscure problems alone.

After I had the first draft done, I started meeting with climbers out there to help me fill in names I didn’t know, or whether certain projects had been done or not. I was also shown a lot of problems that I missed, which I described with the help of the people who showed them to me.

All of the areas are very well described and the maps well laid out and labeled, that must have taken loads of time to get into a readable format. How many iterations did you do of these?
The maps were actually not too hard to make, but I really enjoy making maps and dork out on it a lot, so for me it was really fun. It took me about 6 days to draw the entire boulderfield by hand on paper. Then I took all those pieces of maps and scanned them into the computer, and rescaled and fit them together like a puzzle into one big map. Lastly I colored them in to make them look nice. Every map in the whole book is just a piece of the one big map, which is the overview map in the front of the book. So no matter what map you are looking at throughout the whole book, it is all the same map, drawn the exact same way, oriented in the same direction.

The hard part is numerically labeling the problems in the maps and photos. It is an extremely detail oriented task. I printed out copies of my finished map, and then walked around the boulders drawing in the problems. I could spend a couple days doing that, and then someone would tell me about some problems that I missed. At that point, I would have to renumber the problem descriptions in the text, and the photos, and the maps. This happened more times than I can count, and the attention to detail required is certainly enough to drive one nuts.

The photos are pretty nice as well, from some pretty big named photogs... were there any that you wanted to put in but couldn't?
Not really. I solicited everyone I knew that had photos, and if they took the time to send me stuff, then I made sure to include something from them. My goal was to have the action shots represent the boulderfield as a whole, which I managed to do – easy problems as well as hard, with an equal representation of all parts of the area. In an ideal world, each “model” would only have had one photo in the book, but you have to work with the material you have, and there were plenty of people with their face in there more than once. There were certainly some local climbers that I would have liked to have photos of, but couldn’t find any. It was also a goal to have a local on the cover, but again, I had to choose the most stunning shot, which I think worked out well.

Stone Fort used to be closed to climbers, were you part of the SCC (Southeastern Climbers Coalition) that helped open it up?
The SCC and the Triple Crown Bouldering Series negotiated the open access that we as climbers have today in 2003. This effort was spearheaded by Chad Wykle, Jim Horton, and Dawson Wheeler. I had nothing to do with any of this, and of course owe these guys, and the SCC, a huge debt of gratitude, as we all do.

Chad Wykle and John Dorough still work with the owners of Montlake Golf Course on climber access related issues on nearly a weekly basis. I worked closely with these guys making the Stone Fort Bouldering book, and they are certainly going above and beyond for climbers, the SCC, and the Triple Crown, to keep everything working as smoothly as possible at the Stone Fort.

I have been climbing for the past 15 years, and have touched stone in pretty much every corner of the US. Along the way I have met literally thousands of climbers, and enjoyed hundreds of different areas. In that entire time, I have never seen such a seemingly hopeless access situation turned into such an overwhelmingly positive one as at the Stone Fort. And despite the fact that there are climber advocacy organizations affiliated with virtually every climbing area in the country, not a single one of them can boast anything like the incredible successes that the Southeastern Climbers Coalition has managed time and time again. That is a tribute to their leaders and members – cheers to all those people!

Did you start writing the guide before the areas were officially open to the public?
I began work on the guide way after the area was open to the public, so that was never an issue. However, the owners of Montlake Golf Course had instituted a cap on the number of climbers who could climb at the Stone Fort on any given day, due to overuse problems they had experienced in the past. So, it was generally accepted amongst the community that a guide like this one would not be allowed.

But, through the continued work and negotiations of Chad and John, and the climbers respecting the new rules and cleaning up their behavior over the previous few years, Montlake was becoming open to the idea of more open access, and was considering new rules which would back off some of the previous mandates (these new rules have since been instituted). I heard about these new developments through the grapevine and so began working on the book. I was not super confident that I could pull the whole project off, so I chose to keep it a secret for a while as I began work. After a month or two, I had good momentum on the project, and knew it was time to bring everyone on board. So I dropped off a copy of the new Horse Pens 40 Bouldering guidebook made by Greener Grass Publishing and pitched Montlake on the idea of a similar guide. The managers at Montlake are not climbers, so it took a number of discussions before we were all on the same page, but in the end they were thrilled with the idea, and supported it fully.

What other guides are on the way?
There are a few in the works that I don’t want to reveal. But I can tell you that the next guide from Greener Grass Publishing will be a comprehensive guide to the sport climbing, trad climbing, and bouldering at the Obed River Gorge in Tennessee, written by longtime local and developer Kelly Brown.

Monday, September 13, 2010

Review > So Ill Holds > Knuckles

Soill Holds
Following up on the $200 question (If you missed it you can read it: here) we're looking at some of the starter / bulk sets of holds that you can buy for your first wall. First up we have the So Ill / Cryptochild "Knuckles". When So Ill replied to the $200 question they included the Knuckles as one of the sets that they'd suggest, they included them in the answer for an "Expert" climber. Now we thought that this was a little strange because the "Knuckles" are actually listed as easy on the So Ill holds website... a mystery? Lets see, but first... lets look at the holds in question:












30 holds... that's a lot!

We started filming the walk through and just decided to skip it and get the holds on the wall as fast as possible. Cedric had dropped past and as he is the Andrea Boldrini climbing shoe rep for Canada we figured we'd let him set something... Chris mentioned he was a pretty fast setter as well as being pretty damn strong.

The first route went up and we began to notice something, there are A LOT of hand options on these holds, and when they're set on a steep wall they're more challenging that we expected. First route done we did what we normally do, set something that would be challenging... well challenging was what happened, a nice route that went up across the roof. We were actually being nice when we set the roof, we used the bigger holds, but it still ended up being hard as hell.

So thus far:
  • 45 degree wall: They're a challenge
  • Roof: Even the big holds from the set are harder than we thought
Learning our lesson on the roof, we re-set the route and added twice as many hand holds across so that it'd be easier... yup that works... more holds is better when you're playing with these guys. Route three being dispatched we set what we decided would be a beginner route... HA! Putting the Knuckles onto some Motavation volumes made getting across any horizontal sections nice and easy as the angle of the volumes coupled with the incut nature of the holds means you're playing with what is essentially some mini jugs... and then Chris set a move on the vertical wall that is really stretched and has no feet; it's hard to make the move but again the incut nature of the holds inspires the climber to try something a little outside their comfort zone

Recap:
  • 45 degree wall: They're a challenge... but fun
  • Roof: Even the big holds from the set are harder than we thought, use more holds on the horizontal terrain and they're great
  • Vertical: Easy as hell, these holds are pretty kid / small hand friendly
  • 30 degree wall: this is probably where most intermediate climbers will want to use them
These holds are an interesting mix of hand positions, but the question that needs to be answered is "Are they easy?" Well that's a little tricky. Yes they are easy holds, there are options for hands, lots of options and if you're playing in the realm of say a vertical wall to 30 or maybe even 45 degree walls then they're pretty easy (Obviously easier on a 30 than on a 45). Get them on a roof and they're hard but you can do it... it's just going to push you a little harder than you'd expect.

SUGGESTED USES:







One thing that is noticeable with these holds is that there are options, normally more than one per hold for your hands, so they're incredibly versatile, so when it comes to bang for your buck you're getting something that can offer a number of different variations at the spin of a wrench, or in most cases you can just mentally tell yourself to grab the holds in their secondary position... if you have a home wall with shallow angles and you need to add some variety then these are a pretty good option, we'd say intermediate climbers more than beginners, but if the wall is vertical then beginners will have no problems.

OVERALL BUILD

  • Number of holds: 40
  • Type (Bolt / Screw Ons): Bolt
  • Price per hold (set price divided by number of holds): 176/30 = $5.86 per hold
  • Color: Black
  • Bolt placement: Middle
  • Sanding: Good
  • Hollow backed: No
  • Soft back (Rubber backed): No
  • Texture: Slightly crystalline
  • Set size:
  • Versatility: Great
  • Pre-drilled screw holes: No
  • Shaper: Jason Kehl
  • Weight: 10lbs
What needs to be pointed out is that there are three distinct styles, what we call:
  1. Smooth pinches
  2. Fat lips
  3. Small lips
Smooth pinches (Left image): The smooth pinches generally have a large edge with a nice smooth edge that's quite large on one side and normally have a smaller lip on the other... they make for some really nice pinches that are finger friendly.

Fat Lips (Middle image): The Fat Lips are characterized by their large radii lips that run through the entire set of holds. Although the lips allow people with small fingers to use these holds more like jugs anyone with larger fingers might find them a little shallow

Thin Lips (Right image): These are the most incut of all of the holds some people with sausage like fingers might find getting them around the back and utilizing their full depth. These holds if you've got some steep or roof terrain on your wall are the most likely to be the ones you use up there... just use more of them than you think as they're pretty hard; shallow walls make for easy climbing with these holds.

These holds are really well built; they have a nice weight to them despite their small size, the construction of the holds is such that they have a really good texture to them and the Fat Lips and Smooth Pinches don't have any sharp angles on the shapes, the Thin Lips do have a nice rounded radius to the grabbing area but as they're thin they can seem a little sharper than you'd like when you're hitting them at high speed or when you're cranking hard.

Cryptochild holds are best sampled in black, the color is nice and even across all of the holds... the more chalk you get onto them the better the little Cryptochild skull and logo shine through. None of the holds need a set screw hole as their small stature deems them unnessary!

Sanding across the range is very very good, there isn't one hold that isn't sanded completely flat across the entire range, all of the bolt holes are straight and perfectly drilled with the washers being square and flush to the back of the holds.

WHAT ARE THEY MADE FROM:

Urethane

PACKING / SHIPPING:
Good, the holds were packed into a bag that was sealed; the box came through without too macy scrapes. Some scraping occurred as the holds weren't individually wrapped.

RATING:
Noodles:
These holds certainly look like Knuckles, so the name fits :) Options is a word that's going to be used a bunch, if you're starting to climb, have a basic wall and you need holds that can be used in a bunch of different ways then these guys certainly have options... they're an interesting mix of hard and easy. The way we set they kind of erred on the harder side of the spectrum, but we made sure to set easy routes to see just how easy these holds can be, and easy is something if you just chuck them onto a single panel like we did then you have a wall of holds to just grab and practice moving about on.

Roof? I'd say yeah sure, just add twice as many holds as you think you need because none of these holds are particularly deep, when you're up there they are more like hanging on by your finger tips rather than super deep incuts (We found the Thin Lips the best on a roof)

These holds have a very particular feel to them, the texture is a little crystalline and it gives some really good grip on the shallower shapes without really giving you too much trouble with your skin peeling off. Out of the three "sets" of holds (although they are technically one set of holds) the ones I don't really like are what we call the Thin Lips and I find their edges being a little too thin for my liking and on some of the problems we set I found it hard to get my fingers into the incut (these were some pretty specific moves with some hard body positioning) thus making some of the moves I was trying harder for me than say for Eve who could just slip her fingers into the gap.

I think that if you're looking for a set of holds for a new wall these make for some interesting climbing, steeper terrain is going to be harder and shallow terrain is going to give you the most fun with these guys. When you look at the price you're looking at some really good value... what i'd probably do is pair these with the Herbs (screw on jibs) so that at the same time you're working on your hand strength you can work on your footwork as well.. or if my wall was larger i'd probably look at their Starter Bolt on kit or their Giant Starter Kit as you're going to want bolts as well!!!

Chris:
Starter sets...you could call them that but with the way we set there is nothing beginner about them. I like the fact that So Ill has catered a set for those who are being introduced to the sport but to all the other strong climbers out there, these holds have a place on your wall too. Just in the size of the set alone there is a plethora of problems that could be set. The size of the individual hold is small and won't take up too much room on the wall. We have some pretty big holds like the Boss from Pusher and when we have a few of these features up, there isn't much room left. At least with this starter set, we could have good holds scattered around to play on.

I really like the set as a whole. The shapes are comfortable and I had a lot of fun setting with them. We set the first problem for ourselves and it ended up being much easier than expected. On our next one we really pushed the limit and setting long powerful sequences with these holds and it was fun. I set some problems to work on Nick's technique but the problem either comes out too easy or impossible for him to do. When we set for Nick and Eve, we force a move to make them work but it was much easier for them to work out the sequence with these holds; there are lots of grabbing variations and no one grabbed the same way

Beginner set...definitely, with a big BUT: I wouldn't scratch out buying this set if your not a beginner because they're a whole lot of fun to play with :)

PROS:
  • Lots of grabbing options
  • Small wall foot print
  • Good for beginners and intermediate / expert climbers
  • Large set size, great if you're just building a wall
CONS:
  • The thin lipped holds might be a squeeze for people with big digits